CT Adult Poll Dance #2 'Trainwreck'

[Roshan]

But, his presence is obviously really Se-ish, and I can't see him as my activity partner. I thought both of these things could be accounted for by the energy of his being an Sp dominant with a significant 8 influence, but...

Well, you can keep trying to add on or subtract between the two systems but the complete E type is consistent with the ct. If he's that high Se he's not alpha. To quote that speech, "at the end of the day, it is what it is."

[Roshan]

I'm not gonna lie, I laughed harder while watching that speech than I have to anything else in a while.

One of the main reasons I typed him SiFe was that he just seemed way too [innocently] corny to be SeFi or FiSe—the only other viable typings in my mind—and this speech sort of gets at what I meant...

But that's what makes him your superego, Anthony.

You laughed harder than in a while but -Sarah-, his identical (but in some ways also mirror because he's sooo Se subtype and she's such a jumper) said "I feel like I'm being punched by his emotions."

I'm wondering do both of you (or anyone else) find the music to be 'dramatic' (as Sarah said) in an 'innocent' way?

I find it to be high camp...until it's not anymore. And I find that, and the tension caused by the transition, to be not only intentional but very well-executed.

[Roshan]

I should be clear that after thinking the only type in the debate that worked was SiFe but suspecting he must be beta, so assuming there just wasn't enough there to try to make a call, I didn't really have trouble settling on FiSe just with the OP video. But I don't think that would have happened if I didn't know someone very similar (despite being much less apeish and rather a trash boho dandy) AND if Vincent and I hadn't discussed both Ne PolR and how FiSe is mistyped as Ni dom a lot last year. Not that Mr. Train would be typed as Ni dom, just that we looked at quite a few of these muddy, Se-heavy FiSe's.

Though none quite as beta-ish as he. However, I honestly think this has to do with his physique. The combination of that big head of his and that burning intensity made him so bullied by boys and sought after by girls that it seems to have made him truly unable to ignore the social realm and all its caprices and cruelties. Thinking about Mr. Open Mic, it seems not at all unusual for FiSe to actually overvalue the Fe realm, while also binarizing it (which has to do with incomplete development of Ni, and which -Sarah- linked about above, there's good guys and bad guys)--especially since that's where you get things done so you need it for your Te-finding. And also once you start binarizing it, it's bound to loom large taking on a (larger than) life of its own. But that big head...that being chased by chicks and sticks...it's made a very beta-ish gamma.

I can easily see why Amy said FeNi and that was pretty much the only other one I was seriously considering when I watched the OP. (Though again, having settled with confidence on FiSe, watching group shenanigans after gave me pause). But it's not Fe frame, it's Fi. Take him out of the animal house and everything starts with him and ends with him. His experiences, his past, his feelings, his sense of what has ultimate value, his depths, his despair, his quest...and from there yours.

In fact the 'speech' Sarah linked pretty much epitomizes what we go around saying--Fi understands other people's subjective experiences deeply, or at least understands their potential extent and intensity, because it understands its own. And ultimately he must be gamma-izing his tribe.

[-Sarah-]

I'm not gonna lie, I laughed harder while watching that speech than I have to anything else in a while.

One of the main reasons I typed him SiFe was that he just seemed way too [innocently] corny to be SeFi or FiSe—the only other viable typings in my mind—and this speech sort of gets at what I meant...

But that's what makes him your superego, Anthony.

You laughed harder than in a while but -Sarah-, his identical (but in some ways also mirror because he's sooo Se subtype and she's such a jumper) said "I feel like I'm being punched by his emotions."

He's so loud and intense that it feels like being next to a loud speaker at near max volume.

I'm wondering do both of you (or anyone else) find the music to be 'dramatic' (as Sarah said) in an 'innocent' way?

I think the campiness mainly comes from his earnestness at the time of live-streaming that speech (I do get the impression that he was sincere during that spiel). But I also get the impression that after he reviewed the footage, he realized how goofy he looked and played up the camp. He's in on the joke. He has to know that the mixture of the earnestness, seriousness, and hamminess was hilarious. You said camp fits in with gamma. It's not just about making fun of our own seriousness but it's also ultimately peering behind the curtain and realizing the absurdity of it all. Now I also wonder...if Train, during that live-stream I posted, realized the goofiness of it all and intentionally hammed it up during video while still being ultimately sincere.

I find it to be high camp...until it's not anymore. And I find that, and the tension caused by the transition, to be not only intentional but very well-executed.

[Roshan]

-Sarah-, part of the problem with typing him--and also the reason I started off my comments on the OP by noting he's beefcake for aesthetic reasons (to look proportional, not strong)--is that he's a lot more calculated than he seems, and his reFIned taste is built into this neanderthal burlesque project of his. Listen to the words at the beginning of that speech again. He'll be your boyfriend AND your girlfriend?

Yeah, sure, he mumbles and grunts and doggie paddles inchoately in conversation--because other people bring in the 'uNExpected' and Ne PolR rarely does well with that, especially in public--but when he's on his own and he can call the shots, he controls his material. He was taught very early on in school how absurd he seems; he's always working with that as long as he doesn't have to worry about 'interlocutors'. Basically, this is the gamma gong show.

Speaking of which, in the original Shapiro Extended Family Debate Dinner Theater, I found it odd at the end that he thanked Li'l Hitler for reaching out to him. I couldn't understand why on earth Fuentes would. But they're mirages. And now having seen an array of Train's tracks, there's a reason he gave the moderation over to Asmongold. It's not that he can't facilitate. He certainly facilitates enough b.s. Twitch schmooze fests that look like Hollywood Squares. It's that he knew it was important and that Asmongold would do it better.

This guy has found Te up the wazoo--considering with all that Se-Ne PolR mud what a shit pile his Te must have been before he found it, anyway. He has really made a silk purse out of a sow's ass, as it were. He's very strategic.

Which btw is why you originally voted TiSe. But his T in general is more than role. Though not as good as his Fi sense of burlesque proportion.

Anyway that's my take thus far.

[e-ssam]

I was going between FiSe & TiSe for the first video but he did seem hyper aware of the social & power dynamics and how the same impulse carries out in different circles, knowing how to capitalize and work on that in a beta heavy way.

At first, it seemed like Fe inferior and Ti strategizing. But from the interview, TiSe "quiet" ones (or say...the not very articulate ones) seem to me more clear and delineated in what they choose to speak about, whereas Train is really burning with much more intensity, he's fired up. And even though the Se is very pronounced, it's a gentle giant toughness.

[e-ssam]

I think if a beta where to do a speech in that vein, there's going to be an underlying feeling of it being tongue in cheek. Not with Trainwrecks. I thought the the speech was a bit funny and endearing but ultimately moving (also thanks to the dramatic background music). He's emotionally invested and he doesn't give a f***k that he comes off as cringe - he's expressing his true feelings. I feel like I'm being punched by his emotions.

This type of video shouldn't (and usually doesn't) work on me, the corn rubs me off, or it ends being a big joke.
But dammit he got me

[e-ssam]

Getting the Se polr out

[Roshan]

I feel like I'm being punched by his emotions.

This type of video shouldn't (and usually doesn't) work on me, the corn rubs me off, or it ends being a big joke.
But dammit he got me

He's your benefactor, Sam-I-Am*. He's knocking you off of your know-it-all Ni-Ti pedestal with that Se bludgeon to the head. You will be engaged, said the runaway train.

*Oh, this...

[Roshan]

ps Not implying anything with the Sam-I-Am, just liked how it sounds with e-ssam, then thought you might not get the reference

It's up to you to make inferences.