CT Adult Poll Dance #3 Jim Clark

[Roshan]

He is the cofounder of Netscape and founder of Silicon Graphics (among other tech companies). You can look into those companies but don't look further into him until the green light. History tells us the green light may not be right after the votes are revealed, so wait for it. History also tells us I'm going somewhere with this.

I put him in the ct section for 'reasons' but we are doing a complete typing on him. Polling closes at noon NYC time on Monday, June 13.

[Roshan]

Well, this is all over the place and suffice to say that, other than that we all agree on sp/so, there's very little that I agree with here completely. Which is not to say I think his typing's easy or that I'm sure I'm completely right, but I don't think it should be as baffling as all this. So I think the best way atm to proceed is for me not to divulge what I think so as not to influence people and for you all to discuss among yourselves without looking at any other materials for the time being--because really, this interview is very comprehensive and it's long with a lot of potential points of reference. So all I'll say for now is this: What do you think he means at 8'35" when he says the job at Stanford "was kind of like throwing in the briar patch" and how, if at all, is it significant to any aspect/s of his typing?

[Vincent]

Okay so.... i was expecting it to be pretty tricky and i wasn't confident at all when i voted, but i really didn't expect the votes to be that all over the place and to be that far from what i considered and hesitated about. Actually, i think it's the first time i didn't consider any of the type Vincent s/p people voted for (besides the sp/so stacking).

Ct wise, the types i considered were SeTi, TeSi, TeNi and SeFi, and that's pretty much it, iirc.
It really strikes me that those are all extraverted types while everybody else thought he was an introvert.

Enneagram wise, i mostly hesitated between 3 and the 7/8 space for the lead fixation, and i strongly suspect my enneagram votes got influenced by confirmation bias after i "landed" on SeFi for the ct type.

What do you think he means at 8'35" when he says the job at Stanford "was kind of like throwing in the briar patch" and how, if at all, is it significant to any aspect/s of his typing?

I'm not sure how but i somehow missed that part the first time i watched it. I noticed it when i rewatch it, Vincent verb tense and at that point, i thought it was directly related to what he said a bit before that about his frustration being an academic. I thought he meant that Standford was really not his natural environment, and yet it was somewhere he never escaped. It might very well be confirmation bias again but i kind of took that as a confirmation despite being a "computer guy" he Vincent sentence structure, two possible ways of fixing was not any kind of Ti animal, so to speak, nor any kind of 5 fixer.

Anyway, i will rewatch the whole thing soon.and i will try to expand on this and retrace my steps tomorrow.
In the meantime i'm really really curious this time to hear why people voted the way they did.

[Anthony]

Heavens to Betsy! Oh my oh my, suffice to say, this was a very tricky typing for me. I too am interested in why everyone else voted the way they did.

I myself was all over the place. SeFi, SeTi, TiSe, TeSi, and SiTe were the only types I considered. I landed on TiSe in the end but was not at all certain of it.

I ruled out SiTe pretty quickly. Almost every time the interviewer asked a memory-based question like "How old were you when-?" he was hardly able to answer, once replying with something to the effect of "meh. It doesn't really matter." This, alongside his subtly in-the-moment energetic presence (as opposed to an aura of having "settled into oneself," so to say), made SiTe seem impossible. It also just seems unlikely that he's Fe PoLR.

In considering SeFi, well, unlike Vincent, I figured it was precisely because he was a "computer guy" that he was very unlikely to be Ti PoLR, and that's how I ruled out SeFi. At first, it seemed possible that he had Se and Te in the conscious stack but was in no way FiSe nor an iNtuitive; he had to be a sensor. That's the only reason I briefly considered it. I do however think that it's worth reconsideration.

TiSe was what I considered most heavily, but honestly, not for the best reasons. Upon watching, it seemed to me that he had that sort of...well, his speech patterns seemed revelatory of some natural "TInkering" orientation, which I had based only on prior observations of Ti heavy typing subjects. The words he chose to describe the boss who fired him were, iirc, "totally nuts" and "too irrational," which upon listening struck me as possibly coming from Ne PoLR and reacting to it with Ti stoicism.
Also, probably for obvious reasons, it was hard NOT to see him as ST.
I thought the stuff about memory-based questions could be Si ignoring, which made me consider SeTi with SiTe 'aura,' but...for reasons I'm currently having trouble articulating (not very good reasons, especially since as I write, it's starting to seem exceedingly likely that Se dominance is a real possibility), I put it aside.

The "Si ignoring stuff," along with the fact that in general, he seems very power (rejection triad) oriented, with all the security systems and dogs guarding his yard and his apparent distaste toward the 'delta machine' made me disregard TeSi as a possibility.

Speaking of which—the high-security mansion, the guard dogs, and the millions of dollars of artwork, there was something about him that struck me as markedly J. Paul Getty-ish, but much more normie.
For obvious reasons, he had to be Sp dominant, specifically Sp/So, and he seemed very likely to be either a gut type or a 6w5 (something Marlboro man, Johnny Cash-esque as well).

In the end, my full typing was sp/so 9w8(8w7)-5w6(6w7)-3w2(2w1). 953 seemed wrong when I voted and still seems wrong to me. It was between that and 853. Right now, I'm leaning toward 8 lead, but at the time of voting, well...honestly I really don't know specifically why I chose 9 leading.
He seemed and still seems, as I said, to have a lot of rejection triad stuff going on. I'm not so sure a 5-fix is necessary, but since in my head I had him as more likely a 9 lead, I thought he had to have SOME kind of heavy rejection triad stuff going on, something very Sp 5ish ("Castle," not that Sp 8 wouldn't also be like that), and was ultimately a more 'normie' Getty.

What do you think he means at 8'35" when he says the job at Stanford "was kind of like throwing in the briar patch" and how, if at all, is it significant to any aspect/s of his typing?

I missed this as well, probably because I didn't know what I briar patch was. I'm not sure what he means. If he had said, "[it was] kind of like being thrown in the briar patch," then I'd know more clearly what he meant, but I'm not sure what it means to "throw in the briar patch." Presumably, it means something to the effect of "to jump into a potentially 'defeating' situation" (as opposed to "throwing in the towel" as an admission of defeat); or more literally, "to throw" means something like "playing ball," which by extrapolation would mean "working" or "doing an activity," in which case I'd paraphrase what he said as "it was like playing/working in the briar patch." The latter seems much more likely.
In that case, to me, it seems like added confirmation that he's a high Se user, an 8 (lust), not any kind of delta, and as Vincent said, that he may not be any kind of high Ti user—that he was a fish out of water and knew it very well.

[e-ssam]

I was mostly going between SiFe, SeTi, FeSi & briefly considered TiSe, I hesitantly voted FeSi since it seemed like the 'middle' option. But I miss-touched (on the phone) and only noticed my vote registered as TiNe last night after checking the thread again. I should've done so earlier, sorry.

9w1 seemed wrong when I voted and I was thinking maybe 9w8 more, but I'm not sure why I thought 9 lead either.

Like Anthony, I ruled out Ti polr fairly quickly because he's a "computer guy" and a very successful pioneer.
I didn't know what to attribute his stoicism + "gruff" combination to.

SiFe-Se unignoring seemed to sort of fit with it, so did seamless second row Sx but delta seemed unlikely. TiSe-Se maybe, I don't think his "too irrational" comments were only/mainly about irrationality in the "thinking" sense, seemed more in line with "those people don't play the game properly" though.
(that, and the boss did sound nuts)

So all I'll say for now is this: What do you think he means at 8'35" when he says the job at Stanford "was kind of like throwing in the briar patch" and how, if at all, is it significant to any aspect/s of his typing?

I didn't know what it meant, i just googled the expression and I agree with Vincent and Anthony that it seems likely to mean he was a fish out of water in Stanford.

atm, I'm leaning one of the Se leads. More currently SeTi.

[Roshan]

atm, I'm leaning one of the Se leads.

Why?

[Roshan]

Right now, I'm leaning toward 8 lead, but at the time of voting, well...honestly I really don't know specifically why I chose 9 leading.

And you honestly specifically are now 'leaning toward' 8 lead instead of a 5 fix since he seems to have rejection because...?

[e-ssam]

Stoicism + gruff fits with valued upper slot Se + T than demonstrative Se.

Also,

I don't think his "too irrational" comments were only/mainly about irrationality in the "thinking" sense, seemed more in line with "those people don't play the game properly" though.

if the focus on the "game" is correct ,then Se/Ni as the valued axis fits better than Ne/Si, so does the fish out of water feeling he felt within the community.

I agree too about the distaste to the delta machine.

Still though, i think ST>SF temperament more.
TeNi maybe over SeFi. But leaning overall SeTi at the moment.
I will have rewatched hopefully by tonight or tomorrow morning to add more.

[Vincent]

I ruled out SiTe pretty quickly. Almost every time the interviewer asked a memory-based question like "How old were you when-?" he was hardly able to answer, once replying with something to the effect of "meh. It doesn't really matter." This, alongside his subtly in-the-moment energetic presence (as opposed to an aura of having "settled into oneself," so to say), made SiTe seem impossible.

I'm not so sure that's really what he does, but even if that was the case, vague answers to memory-based question are not necessarily indicative of low Si (despite what Eric Strauss would like you to believe). Some SiTes do that, depending on the topic, and SiFes do that even more. If anything, it's probably more Fi related than Si related.

At first, it seemed possible that he had Se and Te in the conscious stack but was in no way FiSe nor an iNtuitive; he had to be a sensor.

Why were (are ?) you so sure he can't be an intuitive ?

TiSe was what I considered most heavily, but honestly, not for the best reasons. Upon watching, it seemed to me that he had that sort of...well, his speech patterns seemed revelatory of some natural "TInkering" orientation, which I had based only on prior observations of Ti heavy typing subjects.

Why would that TInkering rather than TinkEring Anthony ?

The words he chose to describe the boss who fired him were, iirc, "totally nuts" and "too irrational," which upon listening struck me as possibly coming from Ne PoLR and reacting to it with Ti stoicism.
Also, probably for obvious reasons, it was hard NOT to see him as ST.

Those reasons are not that obvious to me no. One thing most STs do, and TiSe probably even more than other STs, is to specialize. They find "their thing" and they keep doing it. I don't see that with him.

his apparent distaste toward the 'delta machine' made me disregard TeSi as a possibility.

Where do you see a distate for the "delta machine" specifically ?

In that case, to me, it seems like added confirmation that he's a high Se user,

Why ? I'm not done rewatching yet but at the moment, i'm less and less certain about that.

[Roshan]

and that's how I ruled out SeFi. At first, it seemed possible that he had Se and Te in the conscious stack but was in no way FiSe nor an iNtuitive; he had to be a sensor. That's the only reason I briefly considered it. I do however think that it's worth reconsideration.

Why?