Terra Incognita

Members should put exemplars of SeFi's they feel reasonably sure of. Other members should watch the videos at their earliest convenience and like them ONLY if they agree with the typing. If you don't agree say why and/or suggest a different type. We can always make separate typing threads for disputed exemplars. We will cull exemplars for the Study Hall from these threads. If you don't see a thread yet for the type of an exemplar you want to post (ct or E), just create one.

Don't like the videos on this thread unless you agree they're SeFi.

John Mearsheimer, political scientist, 'realist' school (SeTe)



Link to Through the Realist Lens: A Conversation With John Mearsheimer. Text; includes biographical information and young photos.

Mearsheimer's getting watched a lot thus popping up on yt as the horseshit over Ukraine escalates. Thus I stumbled upon him. His no nonsense analysis of US culpability in this disaster resonated with my understanding, which had begun with the original 2016 Bernie Sanders and was the reason I, like many, could almost stomach Trump's win. Now with the saber-rattling I'm even more seen as the red brown ally in the horseshoe theory but isn't that in a way the whole point of the rattling?

What I found perplexing at first with Mearsheimer was his contention that the neocons and their neolib allies actually operate out of belief in a Fukayama-like 'end of history'--the coming of an endless neolib capitalist paradise on earth, that they are fundamentally idealists. This struck me as probably due to his Ti PolR not really thinking things out, and as rather jarringly naive for an Se dom (hard to see an SeTi seeing it this way). And all that may well be true but in a fundamental way I realize he is right...that good ol' Ni finding w/o Fi PolR.

This deranged triumphalist idealism seems to have something to do with how liberalism, which archetypally is 7, will move to 1 and seek an eternity etched in stone. How openness closes and congeals on itself. 7 holds in itself an obsession with the transcendent, and as Sylvia Plath would say, "Perfection is terrible. It cannot have children"*.

Analgous to this is how Ne (which correlates with 7 so highly) becomes constipated with Si--and then if it comes to war, how S is S.


*While I was aware of the Plath posts, and of her at very least very heavy 7, I had forgotten the name of the poem is The Munich Mannequins and...

I'm wondering if Mearsheimer isn't actually TeSe?

Roshan wrote: ↑Fri Mar 25, 2022 6:11 pm I'm wondering if Mearsheimer isn't actually TeSe?

Just downloaded this one to watch it at work (or at least start to)
I'll let you know what i think soon.

Well i watched about 1h of that video and so far i still think SeTe is more likely than TeSe.

I'm finding myself quite spontaneously skeptical of his views, despite the fact i already find the realist approach a lot more convicing than the liberal one, and i doubt it would happen that much or that easily if he was my supervisor.
In this video in particular, i have some issues with his "theorizing", bigger ones than the ones i would expect to have if it was just Ti ignoring. I'll try to explain why soon, but i'll watch the rest of the video first and get timestamps.

tbcd.

I watched the first video up until the Q&A, approximately 44 minutes in. Thus far, I think he's SeTe.

First, I completely agree with what Roshan said regarding his contention that the neocons and neoliberal allies fundamentally operate idealistically, out of a belief in that Fukayama-like 'end of history' and a moral concern for human rights and peace internationally. It did seem likely due to Ti PoLR, quite naive for an Se dom, and it IS hard to see an SeTi seeing it that way.

Second, I'm finding it difficult atm not to see him as having Te agenda. Just watching him, he seems to trust that as long as his ideas are presented in the 'correct' Te format, the 'correct' outline, Ti consistency will just 'happen.'
He also tightly balls his fists a lot and has these very 'clutching' hands, as though passionately wringing the water out of a towel, reveling in the here-and-now physicality of it. Energetically he seems very Se dominant.

Anthony wrote: ↑Fri Apr 08, 2022 2:42 am First, I completely agree with what Roshan said regarding his contention that the neocons and neoliberal allies fundamentally operate idealistically, out of a belief in that Fukayama-like 'end of history' and a moral concern for human rights and peace internationally. It did seem likely due to Ti PoLR, quite naive for an Se dom, and it IS hard to see an SeTi seeing it that way.

The thing is, even if he sounds quite naive on some level, he is also pretty damn right about this. It is also true that the neocons and neoliberals operates under a pretty rigid and often pretty blind idelogical paradigm. But i think this is another argument for Ti polr, as i suspect he is the "canary in the coal mine" here.

Second, I'm finding it difficult atm not to see him as having Te agenda. Just watching him, he seems to trust that as long as his ideas are presented in the 'correct' Te format, the 'correct' outline, Ti consistency will just 'happen.'

Yes, and i also think it's quite suspect that he feels the need to tell those (presumably Ti heavy) "debaters" that he is doing the same thing they do. Why would a T dom social scientist have to explain and somewhat insist that he is doing "theory too" ?

Anyway, i still have to watch the second part of the last video.
I'll try to do that tonight and i'll go back to him soon.
tbcd.

Roshan wrote: ↑Sat Feb 12, 2022 11:42 am
Link to Through the Realist Lens: A Conversation With John Mearsheimer. Text; includes biographical information and young photos.

I don't think anyone looked at this.

Roshan wrote: ↑Fri Apr 08, 2022 2:03 pm I don't think anyone looked at this.

No, i did look at it when you posted it.
But i guess i missed something. I will look at it again.