Terra Incognita

Choose one ct for Trainwrecks by tomorrow (Sunday) night 10 pm NYC time. You can look at other materials (and post them) but don't discuss til voting ends.

I don't know why the poll seems to have ended an hour early but all the votes are in and here's another one.

From this video, he purposely keeps himself beefed up because his head's so big. So his beefcake physique is an aesthetic choice--in what seems to him to be an absence of options (doesn't realize it could be postural). His inarticulateness seems like it has to be Ne PolR OR SiFe, but he seems Se/Ni axis. I don't think this appearance of Se/NI can be due to shadowing into SeFi and also he doesn't seem alpha. He also doesn't seem aloof enough to be TiSe. And he reminds me very much in many ways of an FiSe I know, despite his creating a beta environment around him with his "Apes" group. Also despite his often asking if things make sense, he talks an awful lot about raw emotions. This asking if things make sense is something the other FiSe does too. So I'm sticking with FiSe creative subtype. at least for now.

Longing is the beautiful part, the adventure, the flame that keeps you going. Never what you get. The true adventure is the discovery of self, to find out who you are, facing the darkest parts for self-discovery. All sounds upper slot absolute value Fi with Ne PolR.

So I think he's a gamma leading betas, and acting like a beta to lead them, like Trump. btw I didn't choose this video for any reason other than it was an interview with him and I haven't heard the whole thing yet.

The brotherhood stuff sounds beta but he also says that if he says what matters outloud it takes away from it. As TiSe he should be able to state somehow that the community he made is what matters, both as a beta and due to the clarity of expression of Ti frame. But he won't. The actual Apes tribe isn't of ultimate value to him. Doesn't really sound upper slot Fe.

The FiSe I know is always traveling and starting open mics where he lands even though he's social last and always winds up having problems with groups. But he won't stop trying. And he constantly talks about the people he knows. Constantly.

These two are actually very similar except the other one is exclusively in the arts (music, film and photography) and doesn't care about anything else except psychology, food and traveling. And you'd expect to find an Fi dom more likely in the arts than live streaming video games, gambling and political discussions but you never can tell.

When I saw the debate I couldn't think of anything but SiFe but he reminded me somhow too much of this beta and probable FeNi so I figured I needed to see more of him. I expected him to turn out to be beta but then when I saw the OP video I 'realized' he was FiSe so I voted early. Since then I've seen his antics in groups and they have given me pause, but not enough to settle on something else. Now this one that just came up when I looked for an interview seems to confirm FiSe.

At least up to now. I've watched about a half hour but I see it's very long.

ps I didn't discuss him with Vincent at all.

To be honest after 1 hour 40 minutes of this video, he has to be FiSe. In my book. I don't care what antics he pulls in his group videos.

Someone else may have a different book.

So in this book of mine, Anthony got the SF, e-ssam and Sarah got the Ne PolR and Amy got the first slot F followed by Ni/Se axis.

He is a judger but he is not a thinker. Some of the second part of this video is about his Te seeking in the service of Fi (four years hard work in college doing what you don't want so you can do what you want for 50 years).

He is a feeler but he is not an extravert.

He doesn't lead with S but he is creative subtype Se.

For an understanding of how this ct is even possible with someone like Trainwrecks, especially if you're aware of his more obnoxious shenanigans, it may help to look at Auburn's mythology of dark Se "Ver" (bottom of page). "My" above-mentioned FiSe isn't nearly as Se-heavy as Tyler Faraz Niknam but there is extreme preciousness/vulgarity polarity going on in his aesthetics, with very little in between. It's chi-chi and/or it's Ver pissing. You just never know. Not so much his work as the marketing. We should never forget his trash boho street creds. It's like it would be 'shameful' (one of Trainwreck's common words) to advertise an event with anything 'not punk'. That the world just might be a spittoon should never be off our radar.

So we should look to Auburn but at the same time we should discard his contention elsewhere that Fi is the softest function, softer by far, so so soft. All functions are going to have a yin/yang spectrum. Fi may or may not tend to softness (I'd guess not THAT much because Te in the back pocket tends to hard) but it's definitely not a good idea to go carrying around the idea that if it's very harsh it can't be Fi lead.

And in any case when dark Ver is the tool, dark Ver does its work.

Roshan wrote: ↑Sun Nov 07, 2021 9:22 pm From this video, he purposely keeps himself beefed up because his head's so big. So his beefcake physique is an aesthetic choice--in what seems to him to be an absence of options (doesn't realize it could be postural). His inarticulateness seems like it has to be Ne PolR OR SiFe, but he seems Se/Ni axis. I don't think this appearance of Se/NI can be due to shadowing into SeFi and also he doesn't seem alpha. He also doesn't seem aloof enough to be TiSe. And he reminds me very much in many ways of an FiSe I know, despite his creating a beta environment around him with his "Apes" group. Also despite his often asking if things make sense, he talks an awful lot about raw emotions. This asking if things make sense is something the other FiSe does too. So I'm sticking with FiSe creative subtype. at least for now.

I initially typed him as TiSe creative with pronounced Fi role because I got swept up by the beta talk. But he comes off as more explicitly earnest and emotionally upfront than betas. For example in this video I just found,



I think if a beta where to do a speech in that vein, there's going to be an underlying feeling of it being tongue in cheek. Not with Trainwrecks. I thought the the speech was a bit funny and endearing but ultimately moving (also thanks to the dramatic background music). He's emotionally invested and he doesn't give a f***k that he comes off as cringe - he's expressing his true feelings. I feel like I'm being punched by his emotions.

Come to think of it, he does embody the socionics description of gamma Fi/ESI which is characterized by:

Fi blocked with Se
-Gamma types take a hard-line approach regarding ethical principles and the punishment, even revenge, on those who break them.
-Gamma types place high value on personal loyalty, once they feel a close relationship has been established.
-Gamma types like to discuss personal relationships in a realistic manner and are skeptical that "jerks" can ever become "nice people", for instance.

https://www.sociotype.com/socionics/quadras/Gamma
https://www.sociotype.com/socionics/types/ESI-ISFj/
(These descriptions aren't perfect but I think they do get to the essence of the types.)

Though the way we go about it is very different, I can relate to the intensity and force of the way he experiences and expresses his emotions and convictions as well as his orientation towards people and relationships. There's too much emotional gravitas present for him to be TiSe.

Although it does make sense to me that he's FiSe and I agree with the points being made above, I'm not gonna lie, I laughed harder while watching that speech than I have to anything else in a while.

One of the main reasons I typed him SiFe was that he just seemed way too [innocently] corny to be SeFi or FiSe—the only other viable typings in my mind—and this speech sort of gets at what I meant...

But, his presence is obviously really Se-ish, and I can't see him as my activity partner. I thought both of these things could be accounted for by the energy of his being an Sp dominant with a significant 8 influence, but...