Gram the Grown Up #13 Chanti the Fairy Duster

[Roshan]

What's her type? Choose four answers.

Feel free to dig up other materials if there are any. I haven't seen any but there is lots to peruse here! Poll ends on Saturday, 9/21 right before midnight Sunday, 9/22, 6 am New York time.



asmr youtube channel
https://www.youtube.com/@MoonflowerChanti_ASMR

https://www.tiktok.com/@moonflowerchanti

https://www.facebook.com/moon.flower.735

https://www.pinterest.com/moonflower735/

[Roshan]

More fairy dust.

[Roshan]

I voted with my dummy account to test out the poll (it is and isn't working), and then voted later as myself but that vote did not go through (part of the isn't working part). The dummy vote was a typing of her I had "settled on" and discarded. She is the hardest typing I've done in a long time but I feel I am very close to resolution (not that I didn't feel this way three times already but this time is different ). I will just say for now that I am sure (in as much as one can ever be sure in this field) that she is:

[sx/sp], range to be determined
3w42w3 fixed
9w11w2 fixed
head is on the 6/7 line, either 6w77w8 or 7w66w5.and I am leaning toward cph sx Six now, as lead.

As it has come to my attention that more people are reading this site than I thought, I will also say that I have not once but twice "settled" on 4w33w2 fix and that was my original typing, and not once but twice "settled" on 7w6 lead, and that was also my original typing, so what I do decide will be because of many things, but it won't be because I'm "gatekeeping".

tbc'd

[Roshan]

Some Chantyisms:

boldface = she emphasized, underline = I'm emphasizing

First video

@13'40" Because when I'm in charge and I like actually push through, then it's like a super cool team and it's way more magical and I know I can do it".

@14'11" Sorry, but to come back to the fucking coworkers...

@14'36" And my coworker, she said to me, yeah, you have to be very...uh...very grateful for a boss that she granted you this, that you could go there...uh... because otherwise you couldn't have gone and then you have to stay here to work, and I said to her, you know what, I don't fucking give a shit, I would have just left, like I don't fucking work, I don't live for this job, like I can find a new job, I don't fucking give a shit. Like this is the first...like you know...this goes...um...this is my priority basically, because like...like whatever, I'm not going to fucking not do it just because the boss said so, like fuck that!"

* * *
A pause to say it has to be seen and heard, the rigidity matters, the tone matters, where is the teflon of the 5/7 line, massive authority issues up the wazoo, oh the sheer and utter exertion of having fun... But let us continue.
* * *

@20'26" (when asked how she is about rules) I mostly at the beginning, when I'm like in a new place, I learn the rules from the place and find out like what the limits are and what like people get really angry about, so I know where the plan is, you know, I know where all the limits are

@21'20" And I think...there's also like a knowing...yeah...because I think if you doubt about yourself you maybe...like...um...also radiate that thing outwards and then people won't maybe believe you or something? I don't know." [Why would doubt even be an issue for a Seven here? This is counterpassion Doubt. "I don't doubt."]

Okay, this is getting tedious. She is a cph sx 6w77w8. I'll jump to one that I particularly want to find now.

Second video

@9'54" So Sevens are super restless...um...they will have lots of ideas constantly in their mind like...like...ping ponging and whatever...new possible fun ideas, especially when things are boring they will just flee into their minds and just start thinking of all the different things they can be doing or...maybe they see something in the corner of their eye and that will spark something, like an idea and they will be ping ponging, just like brewing up new things" [Actually, ping ponging is the basic structure of the Six mind. Seven thoughts don't ping pong, they bubble up. But that wasn't the quote I was looking for. Onward].

* * *
It's interesting how she lights up and gets all animated when she talks about the sexual variant of Seven whereas until then she sounded like she was reciting notes she had studied for a test. Onward.
* * *
From the get go I found the repeated use of the word "hobby" for the Seven's ephemeral pursuits to stick out as quite curious. It seemed way too "workmanly" for Seven. Onward.
* * *
lol When I was typing her as a Seven, it really struck me that she recommended Sevens should just sit with their pain for a short time, 30 minutes. Why not fifteen, I wondered. 30 minutes for a Seven to start off with would be an eternity.
Onward ho. Where is that damn word I'm looking for?
* * *
The part about the crushing disappointment Sevens feel when they realize other people can't do things for them and they have to go it alone is pure unadulterated Six. Ho ho ho Merry Christmas. Where is that word? Thing is almost over.
* * *
Nope. Couldn't find where she talked about the Seven hero. Must be somewhere in the other video. But you know what I did find? The thing that I've been saying since I first watched the first video (and I've since watched it five more full times plus isolated sections)--this quality that it seems like she could shatter and break into pieces--that thing is anxiety.

Ah, Chanti "I'm-gonna-have-fun-goddamit-what-the-fuck-you-gonna-do-about-it-huh?" Francheschi.

[Roshan]

The Four fix was highly problematic from the get go because it would have had to be a Four @ Two that manifested as "I have no problems" (dare I say a shallow Four?) But by the end of the first video I found myself going there. Why? I'm not sure. But someone rebutted me and that sent me down a very zig zaggy road. I feel I'm at the end of it now. But toward the end, having settled on Seven for the second time, I looked at her photos on her facebook page, the older ones in the section just called Photos, I thought, very clearly, But this girl is a Beauty Six! There was just no doubt about it. The videos could have gone either way but...not those photos.

"The hardest to identify of any fixation is the male beauty sexual Six...[who] may look like a cross between a Four and a Seven, dressing like a Four but windsurfing like a Seven."--Eli Jaxon-Bear. Ditto, it appears, for the female.

Although I do think if I had been just asked cold to type her without her having a typing already, I would have known my own. That body language--that rigidity with those arms flailing like a slo-mo flamenco dancer--and that bull fighter get up--(cf. Eli again)--far too close to home for me not to call it had I been left to my own devices.

[Roshan]

Perhaps the cutest Chantyism--and one that stood out like a sore thumb when I typed her (twice) as a Seven--is the part where the fucking coworker wants to throw out her painting. And she is riding off into the sunset to Australia and what will be left of her at the school when she's gone and will she have been valued and what will the kids have to make magic with and on and on, and then at the end...and what if one day she needs that job again?

[Roshan]

The Four fix was highly problematic from the get go because it would have had to be a Four @ Two that manifested as "I have no problems" (dare I say a shallow Four?) But by the end of the first video I found myself going there. Why? I'm not sure.

I'm not sure but part of it was that if Two, whose comfort zone is "I have no problems" can be beset with problems to the point of deep-seated melancholy at Four (and it can), why can't it be the other way around?

But it's a lot easier for the problem-free Two to succumb to problems than for the problem-wallowing Four to get to 'no problems'. After all, problems do beset us in life. Very different story falling downhill than clawing one's way up--up up up to the pinnacle.

Don't get me wrong, Chanti has problems. She is persecuted by fucking coworkers, she is almost always but not always liked for improving people's lives by being a magical fairy "creature", people infected by attachment and the social instinct put expectations on her that she often doesn't even understand, she has to think about the consequences of her actions on other people.

But none of this remotely falls under the all-consuming existential dimensions of E4's Tragic Sense of Life. Here Chanti is relentlessly positive in a way that even Seven leads with Four do not approach. (See Robyn Hitchcock and Florence Welch for a couple of extremely clear examples). So positive that when she is asked about her "suffering", she has to, after talking about something else, ask what the question was, was it about "pain"?

But I am always aware that we are probably missing some Fours and Four fixers here--though not as many as some would have us believe--and I am always on the lookout for them. So I thought, at times, well, the intensity is there and so is the aesthetic orientation. Why not Four for Chanti? Maybe this is a for us new kind of Four, one in which the chief feature Melancholy just doesn't show? After all, if there are humbled Twos...

And where did my original 2w1 typing come from? Well, when people start in with fairy dust and princesses and the like, my mind immediately goes to Two. sp Two is the fairy tale princess, human or fairy. Though it's usually 2w3 but Chanti seemed too strident and critical to be on the 'most interpersonal' line (2/3). Anyway that's what brought in the sp dominant too. Then there was the issue that, as Naranjo brilliantly noted and has been corroborated to me irl, sp Two treats people like dolls and wants to be a doll.

And I thought, well, a full-grown adult fancying themselves throwing pixie dust at everyone to save them sounded plenty enough like Two dolling around to me. There was also the level of self-absorption, because sp Two rivals Four on that front. But it turned out the compliance (or as Chanti disparagingly calls it, the superego), the rescuing, was in the Six lead, and the self-absorption...well, I've warned people many times that there is nothing more narcissistic than an sx Six stressed to Three.

And I oughtta know.

[Roshan]

If you look at the summary of Naranjo's sp Two from his 2004 IEA talk (which wasn't even where he brought up the dolls), you should be able to see why sp Two seemed highly plausible for our fairy duster, especially at the times when the intensity of the sx dom seemed leveled out by a certain waxenness to her. So how come 3w4?

Many reasons, and not all my own: the sheer amount of mastery it takes to so successfully hone an image like that (so should be one competency type and that would be Three), the Deceit involved in it, the overwhelming aesthetic stance on life which, if not Four, should still be in the Four space, the sheer time it takes to dress and make yourself up for said image each time (that is on the 3/4 line--hyper-productivity with overcoming of shame), also the waxenness was itself an indication of Three.

This last indicated by someone else and indeed, if you look closely at her, her hectoring her tormentors in abstentia aside, there is a quality to Chanti that is this kind of Three--placidly presiding over the ballroom, pinkies up nibbling delicately on an hors d'oeuvre, preparing to dance a Minuet. There is also, along with that utter lack of smoothness, a duchess in there. The head slightly tilted up in noblesse oblige, the "I liiike that. Yeah..." drifting off in sublime approval. You wonder, where is the lace fan? So 3w4 it is, I resolved, after having cast my second, ill-fated vote.

Then how do you account for the fairy dust, I was challenged. idk, I shrugged. On the 2w3 subwing? After all, as Chanti will tell you, we are very complicated creatures. And anyway, as pointed out to me by this challenger, it's not impossible that Chanti didn't relate to pixies and fairies until she was typed as a Seven (she states she did not initially type that way)--and that would be...Deceit.

Who knows? Perhaps one day we shall know the truth.

[Roshan]

About the ct, my first impressions were NeFi but she began to reveal herself as a sensor, and then I thought FiSe despite being well aware of the difficulties with her being either an introvert or Ne PolR. I first "settled" on FiSe because the pixie dust throwing and such seemed very FeSi, in its cutesiness, its peopliness, its unctuousness, and its pointlessness (Ni PolR) , but she didn't seem FeSi--not alpha and a clear "Fi user". So I thought she must be shadowing into FeSi.

Also I rejected the consensus typing of SeFi out of hand because someone that 'shatterable' can't be Se dom, yet felt pleased that FiSe was so close to it. So I went with FiSe with reservations. These reservations became severe objections the more I saw in the Instagram and other links just how Ne PolR she wasn't.

And then there was nowhere else to go but TeSi, but, despite having the advantage of Ni PolR, it didn't seem quite right. Still it was what I voted the second (ill-fated) time. ST and extravert seemed more and more right but TeSi not quite. Vincent and I refined this later to TeNe. That also could account for her thousand-armed Hindu goddess hand moves coming out of what Auburn calls the "cobra" structure of SeNi upper body movements. She should by those movements be an SeNi user, but no beta or gamma worked. But a TeNe jumper should push out the demonstrative sixth Se, according to us, so that also works.

So TeNe sx/sp (midstream) 6w77w8-3w42w3-9w11w2 for Chanti. And just how does a sexual Six develop a counterphobia around 'fun'? (Assuming this even existed before she became a Seven). Good question, but Iggy Pop is probably one of those too. There are more good questions, and well, we're complicated.

But when it comes to someone being in a relationship for 17 years thinking nothing was wrong with their not being listened to and being specifically told not to talk about their feelings, the answer to the question how is this a Four fix really should be it's not. And yet I started off with it and even went back to it once. Go figure.

I keep coming back to the Four issue here. If it weren't for the Four fix issue there would definitely be no thread on Chanti and I will always keep coming back to the Four as long as there are Enneagram groups where almost all the women type as Fours or Four fixers. As long as Four is being portrayed as just a very narrow band of negative emotions by 3w4 Mechanical Heart fixer teachers typed as Fours . And as long as a David Gray of an Enneagrammer, when asked by a Josh of an Enneagram School how he deals with identity issues, says well, my Four fix is last so I don't really think much about identity. (That isn't how it works. You don't have a Four fix that's in the front or the back of your socks drawers. You are a Four in the heart center).

But I'm finding I'm enjoying, thanks to The Enneagram School, being in a position where I can finally address the excesses of the two remaining at least partly public groups tracing back to eidb: Enneagrammer and EnneaGOD (Vitchy Vibecraft being all private and Typewatch being dormant). eidb--Riso Hudson's discussion board--closed around nine years ago. It was a hot mess but there were a lot of pearls in that swine pen. They should have been necklaces by now. They are not. I want to try to string them.

I just hope we'll have more readers.

[Vincent]

Okay so..

Ct-wise my first impressions were pretty similar to Roshan's.
FeSi-ish but not FeSi, nor any kind of alpha, and maybe not even F dominant. I did consider a few short-lived options like FiSe in shadow and even NiFe in shadow then i landed for a while on NeFi, suspecting that the FeSi-ishness was actually Fe demonstrative.
From there i moved to TeSi, with an increasing degree of certainty, because i started seeing more and more S as i watched more materials. Se had to be somehow higher than role and Si inferior seemed more and more wrong too.
I still had a few issues with it, most of which got solved by tweaking it to TeNe, but i felt pretty good about voting to give her the same type as so many dandies (and also, according to us, Leonardo Da Vinci). There is definitely some real virtuosity there.

Enneagram-wise it was pretty convoluted process.
The only thing that remained stable the whole time was the gut fix, which seemed to be very clearly 9w1.
For the heart i went back and forth between 2w1 and 3w4 too many times to remember and finally landed on 3w4 as i was moving the ct to TeSi, not just because enneagram and ct correlates better this way (and they certainly do) but because i felt pretty strongly she HAD to have a competency fix in her tritype, and that competency fix had to be 3.
For the head i started with 7 but it eroded over time as i was seeing more and more sixishness all over the place. After i finished watching the last video i was pretty much sold on sx "beauty 6" for her and i was also pretty happy with 369 over 379 for her tritype. Chanti might be some kind of "Operator", but definitely not a smooth one, and she is not quite a Pied Piper either.
My mistake was that i didn't take the extra step of making that 6 lead. And the reason for that is that i was also wrong about the stacking.
I had considered both sx/sp and sp/sx but So last seemed impossible so i thought it would be so/SX. Dark Social and Festooned Regalia both seemed to make sense, and the whole fairy dust thing sounded like so/sx "cross-polination" to me.

When i saw Roshan finally typing i realized (in a major "Duh" moment) that what i was seeing as "not social last" was actually in the Six lead itself, and then sx/sp had to be right.